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Ladies Against Women, 1980-1983

1982-11-18 San Francisco Examiner Article: "Hot night on pros and cons of feminism"

A2 S.F EXAMINER Thurs, Nov 18, 1982

Hot night on pros and cons of feminism. 

2,000 hear ERA-fighter Schlafly, rights-backer English swap shots. 

By Mireya Navaroo 
Examiner staff writer

"Why did the Equal Rights Amendment fail as it did?" Tom Taylor never found out. Just as he was getting ready to pose his query to the anti-ERA activist Phyllis Schlafly and feminist Deirdre English during their debate last night at San Francisco State University, he was turned away 
   There was time for only one more question from the audience he was told and it belonged to a woman. 
  "It was a fair thing," Taylor 22, who had thrown his arms up in despair as the crowd cheered, said later "This was a woman's issue and women should have the first priority." 
   Yet, there were almost as many men as women among the 2,000 paying attendants who filled up the university's gym for the "Two Views on Women" event sponsored by Associated Students Performing Arts. 
  And it was a male, Schlafly's husband, Fred, who got as much attention as such other debated issues as abortion, draft for women, and equality. 
   "I'm sorry I can't share my husband with all of you but there are a lot of wonderful men out there if you only get the chip off your shoulder and turn around and look," said Schlafly after espousing the joys of marriage and motherhood.
      But it was English the one who brought him up first, and again and again. 
   "A man," she said "who boasts that after six children he never once changed a diaper." A millionaire corporate lawyer she said, who married late and given his wife's "be a virgin, marry a virgin" beliefs, deserved a round of applause "for his prolonged virginity."
  In the end many in the audience seemed to think such personal, albeit sometimes amusing, attacks on Schlafly worked to English's detriment even though she evidently had the majority on her side. 
   "I'm a feminist and I've found myself very disappointing at this debate," a women told her during the question-and-answer period. "Is it possible to debate Schlafly without succumbing to the temptation of attacking her?" 
  Schlafly, however, remained poised through both English's sarcastic pokings and the crowd's frequent hissing. 
   An attorney and writer who led the nation's Stop ERA forces and runs the "pro-family" Eagle Forum, she also unintentionally brought the house down with laughter with such remarks as "being a woman in America means having a whole cafeteria array of choices."
   But intimidated she wasn't.
   "Feminism went out of style," the 57-year-old conservative from Alton, Ill., said. "Feminism is now passe" 
   According to Schlafly, the two-career woman, she who devotes her younger years to homemaking and motherhood and then sets out to pursue other interests, is the most fulfilled. 
   Describing the joy such things as gathering her husband and children at Christmastime or as having her first grandchild bring her, she said: "That's living—love, joy, fulfillment," 
   English, the 34-year old editor of Mother Jones Magazine whose stance for equality between the sexes, abortion, draft for women and lesbianism is exactly the opposite to what  Schlafly advocates, said she was confused. 
   "A concept of love that's based on dominance and submission completely confuses me," she said. 
    Feminism, she said, calls for total equality between men and women, a goal that can be achieved only if women have control over their "sexual and reproductive biology" and have the ability of supporting themselves independently. 
    "In the long run feminism will prevail because it's moral, fair and democratic, necessary and preferable," she said. 
   About eight members of the Berkely-based tongue-in-cheek group called "Ladies Against Women" staged a "tasteful and feminine picket reception" for Schlafly outside the gym. 
   The Ladies, whose literature describe them as wanting to bring back "the good old days, whenever they were" were urging Schlafly among other things to "extend the right to life to all Americans—Protect the unconceived!" and to repeal the women's vote—"it's suffering not suffrage, that keeps us up on our pedestals." 
   Schlafly and English had never met each other until last night. Although shaking hands at the onset of the debate, they met the press in separate rooms afterward. 
   Schlafly on English: "The personal attacks didn't bother me. It just shows she didn't have anything to say."
  English on Schlafly: "I genuinely like Mrs Schlafly. She believes in what she says, crazy as it is." 
  The women, who received $2,500 each for their appearances last night, disagreed on one final point. Each thought she had won the debate. 

Examiner photos by Fran Ortiz 

Magazine executive Deirdre English, above, had a few gibes not only fort Phyllis Schlafly but also for Schlafly's husband, Fred, as she spoke to an overflow audience at San Francisco State University. Schlafly, left, listened coolly and then retorted that 'feminism is now passe.'

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A2 S.F EXAMINER Thurs, Nov 18, 1982 Hot night on pros and cons of feminism. 2,000 hear ERA-fighter Schlafly, rights-backer English swap shots. By Mireya Navaroo Examiner staff writer "Why did the Equal Rights Amendment fail as it did?" Tom Taylor never found out. Just as he was getting ready to pose his query to the anti-ERA activist Phyllis Schlafly and feminist Deirdre English during their debate last night at San Francisco State University, he was turned away There was time for only one more question from the audience he was told and it belonged to a woman. "It was a fair thing," Taylor 22, who had thrown his arms up in despair as the crowd cheered, said later "This was a woman's issue and women should have the first priority." Yet, there were almost as many men as women among the 2,000 paying attendants who filled up the university's gym for the "Two Views on Women" event sponsored by Associated Students Performing Arts. And it was a male, Schlafly's husband, Fred, who got as much attention as such other debated issues as abortion, draft for women, and equality. "I'm sorry I can't share my husband with all of you but there are a lot of wonderful men out there if you only get the chip off your shoulder and turn around and look," said Schlafly after espousing the joys of marriage and motherhood. But it was English the one who brought him up first, and again and again. "A man," she said "who boasts that after six children he never once changed a diaper." A millionaire corporate lawyer she said, who married late and given his wife's "be a virgin, marry a virgin" beliefs, deserved a round of applause "for his prolonged virginity." In the end many in the audience seemed to think such personal, albeit sometimes amusing, attacks on Schlafly worked to English's detriment even though she evidently had the majority on her side. "I'm a feminist and I've found myself very disappointing at this debate," a women told her during the question-and-answer period. "Is it possible to debate Schlafly without succumbing to the temptation of attacking her?" Schlafly, however, remained poised through both English's sarcastic pokings and the crowd's frequent hissing. An attorney and writer who led the nation's Stop ERA forces and runs the "pro-family" Eagle Forum, she also unintentionally brought the house down with laughter with such remarks as "being a woman in America means having a whole cafeteria array of choices." But intimidated she wasn't. "Feminism went out of style," the 57-year-old conservative from Alton, Ill., said. "Feminism is now passe" According to Schlafly, the two-career woman, she who devotes her younger years to homemaking and motherhood and then sets out to pursue other interests, is the most fulfilled. Describing the joy such things as gathering her husband and children at Christmastime or as having her first grandchild bring her, she said: "That's living—love, joy, fulfillment," English, the 34-year old editor of Mother Jones Magazine whose stance for equality between the sexes, abortion, draft for women and lesbianism is exactly the opposite to what Schlafly advocates, said she was confused. "A concept of love that's based on dominance and submission completely confuses me," she said. Feminism, she said, calls for total equality between men and women, a goal that can be achieved only if women have control over their "sexual and reproductive biology" and have the ability of supporting themselves independently. "In the long run feminism will prevail because it's moral, fair and democratic, necessary and preferable," she said. About eight members of the Berkely-based tongue-in-cheek group called "Ladies Against Women" staged a "tasteful and feminine picket reception" for Schlafly outside the gym. The Ladies, whose literature describe them as wanting to bring back "the good old days, whenever they were" were urging Schlafly among other things to "extend the right to life to all Americans—Protect the unconceived!" and to repeal the women's vote—"it's suffering not suffrage, that keeps us up on our pedestals." Schlafly and English had never met each other until last night. Although shaking hands at the onset of the debate, they met the press in separate rooms afterward. Schlafly on English: "The personal attacks didn't bother me. It just shows she didn't have anything to say." English on Schlafly: "I genuinely like Mrs Schlafly. She believes in what she says, crazy as it is." The women, who received $2,500 each for their appearances last night, disagreed on one final point. Each thought she had won the debate. Examiner photos by Fran Ortiz Magazine executive Deirdre English, above, had a few gibes not only fort Phyllis Schlafly but also for Schlafly's husband, Fred, as she spoke to an overflow audience at San Francisco State University. Schlafly, left, listened coolly and then retorted that 'feminism is now passe.'